[pugnacious]

Will the ZR160 (282mm) brakes fit under a 15" rim?

Need to uprate the rally car brakes from std 1.4 and have too many 15" wheels to change rim sizes....

 

[Typhoon 180]

if it is a steel wheel then they just fit under

 

[pugnacious]

Mixture of standard alloys and Toora Competizione Alloys. Anyone know what the internal diameter of a 15" steel is? or the diameter of 160 brake disc + caliper?
Failing that what is the best brake upgrade I can fit under 15" wheels?
Under Tarmac rally conditions and using Ferodo DS3000 pads we are killing a set of standard 1400 solid discs in 30 miles. Is the 120 or Diesel an option?

Neil

 

[Typhoon 180]

its the caliper that is the closest to the wheel and sometimes catches there

 

[Ritchy]

mine fitted under some fox racing alloys, think it depends on the maker

 

[garythesnail]

. . . . . Ferodo DS3000 pads we are killing a set of standard 1400 solid discs in 30 miles. Is the 120 or Diesel an option?

Neil

If you're limited to 15" wheels, it may be an option to go for 262mm vented discs from a VVC or Turbo coupe, R8 GTi 200/400s, Vi, BRM, ZR 120 and several vesions of HHR bubble 400s.

These 262mm vented discs are going to be a hell of a lot better than the solids and worked with OE 15" wheels from Rover.

 

[pugnacious]

Ok so it looks like ZR 120 262dia vented discs then with calipers to match.
Are the pads the same shape/ size as other calipers in the range as there don't seem to be many options for racing pads for these calipers. Also where would be the best place to be buying NEW (not recon / reman) calipers from including the sliders.

I know....Questions, questions etc etc...:daft:

 

[garythesnail]

I can't help you with performance pads - my ZS180 is on OE discs and pads and used on the road only. It may be worth sending a PM to Rally Matt here - he has a high opinion of standard MG discs and pads . . . . . . even in competition use.

As for calipers - I haven't used them myself (and don't work for them!), but "Big Red" seem to have a very good reputation.

Big Red website home page

Big Red - MG calipers on E-bay

Rover calipers on E-bay

Latest positive comment I've seen here:

Big Red Opinion on .org

 

[pugnacious]

Interesting. I will give them a call tomorrow.
Thanks

 

[MILO-RJ]

On my car i am running vented 262mm front discs with ap racing fluid with mintex F4 pads under 14" wheels, used to use DS3000, the F4 pad gives a much better bite than the ferodo pad, wear wise...... they are my first set, and really impressed wih them. on the rear i have standard 262mm 160 rear discs and calipers with standard pads in them, works A1

 

[pugnacious]

Sounds good Milo. I have been in touch with PTP at Hinckley and they are able to supply 262 vents, calipers, carriers and Ferodo pads at a reasonable price. Just need to wait for payday now...
I have never used F4 pads, how do they compare against Ds3000 for high temp fade and costs? Guess I'll have to talk to Questmead as well.
Already bought ZR160 rear disc setup, just fitting that now.

 

[Talkingcars]

I very much doubt that the 282mm discs will fit under the 15" rim.

 

[MILO-RJ]

The f4 pads are only a couple of quid cheaper than the Ds3000 and work awesomely, they only get better as they get hotter, no fade with heat or any other issues so far, you will not be dissapointed with them, trust me! if you want the part number, i have that if you need it.

 

[garythesnail]

I very much doubt that the 282mm discs will fit under the 15" rim.

Apparently, they can be made to fit under some 15" wheels with the aid of some spacers. Not done this myself (and neither am I likely too - I really don't like the idea of spacers)

 

[Snowy Senior]

I did send my reply by mistake to wrong thread. It seems that it have not reached everyone so......:agh:

A true knowledge of the subject is always more than supposition.
Also in this case. ZR 160 front brakes WILL FIT inside of every 15" alu wheel.
Competition or road.

With steel wheels the offset is critical, and might make problems. What I have tested ET49 mm won`t fit but ET30 mm did.Easily. But in rallysport we are not using steel wheels if not pointed by a gun.

I have used for my gravel tyres ( 185 or 195 /65 - 15 ) Revolution 6" x 15" ET35 rims. Strong enough and not expensive. They fit ZR body without any hammering and do made also max. allowed track width in grp. N. As from my picture you can see, there is clearance enough. In my case 8 mm to nearist point.

295 or 300 mm brake disk is max which can be used inside of 15"wheel. depending how slim 4 pot caliber is. S1600, S2000 and WRC rallycars are also using 15" gravel tyres.
In rally use the clearance of 5 mm would be ideal minimum for a club men. We often do hit tarmac edges, huge pot holes, or your head size rocks with full speed. Tyre wont broke but wheel will bend......a lot.

On street car, if the driver is very , very carefull 3 mm might do.

So IN REAL LIFE 15" wheel is ok with ZR 160 front barkes. No problem at all.

All MG brakes suffer about not having many options for real competition pads. Selection for ZR160 front brakes is even smaller. But as always, I do have an alternative pad to use to get more real quality options for rally use.
If Mr. Pugnacious do want to have a info about this he is allowed to send a PM to me.

Snowy

Ps. Nissan Primera P12 2002 - model made in UK use the same Lucas front caliber than ZR 160.

Sorry, should be at ZR 160 brakes thread.
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The ultimate (biggest ) Std road car front brakes which goes into 15" al-wheel is front brakes from Civic-R ( 2000 - 2005). The disk od is 300 mm, and the caliber is like in ZR 160, but having a bit different size and shape of brake pad. The caliber is tall and that`s why so close to the wheel " center groove" inner surface, that when wheel do hit something hard a smallest bend is enough for immediately touch to the caliber. A lot of broken wheels and calibers in FRC pace note rallies.
Advantage is that every single manufacture have real competition pad for those brakes. :yup:

 

[pugnacious]

Hmm, a lot of food for thought on this thread. Mr Snowy, what you are saying makes perfect sense. My Alu wheels are ET42 and just clear ZR160 calipers but are too close for practical use. I would not wish to change wheels to a greater offset as I have too many of them to change, it would cost me a fortune. I have yet to make a final decision on the front brakes (rear are now ZR160 discs) but now will have to wait until after christmas before I buy.
Next year we are hoping to compete in the Flanders International Rally Challenge in Belgium and need to see what competition there is likely to be in each class before we take the plunge.
I have had 3 years in Group N1 and usually win my class as there is little competition. Good for the trophy cabinet but more fun beating bigger / faster cars.
By the way Mr Snowy, is that your car on rallycarsforsale.net in the www.Diffdealer.fi advert?.

I will let you know which way we go on this.We have until May before the first rally next year.....

 

[Snowy Senior]

Hi again

An economic solution is to buy 2 sets of Grayston Competition Wheel Spacers.
10 mm thick will do if your tyres are not veeery wide. ( You can test it with installing some washers between present wheel and wheel hub to see if tyres are still inside of fenders )

These sets are made for one axle, including 8 longer hard bolts + two spacers.
Two sets of those will cost only 46 £, so can`t be a problem.

There are also wheel spacers which do have a guiding edge for hub and the wheel. Look about internet. I used those in my previous rally monster . Worked well 6 years. Should not be much more expansive.

With these you can have big brakes without loosing too much money. Change wheel bolts during annual service.

Yes, seems to be my car. I´m servicing Gripper diffs to him, and also installing gear sets into customers casings. Janne is not very good with spanners. Well I´m not very angry even he did not ask from if he is allowed to use my picture.