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Lovin' the torque
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Discussion Starter #1
Just thought I'd detail my experience when going from a 180 to TDI recently.

I'd been thinking about changing my 180 to a TDI for a long time. I absolutely loved the Mk2 180 but I'd had it for over 4 years and 64k miles so I fancied a change, and some better MPG. So I managed to find a 115 TDI ZS with only 26k miles and the full 180 kit, including body kit, spoiler, wheels and climate control. Brilliant... or so I thought!

So I bought the diesel and sold my 180 to a friend for a bargain price (in retrospect) but so far I have to say I've found the diesel disappointing. It seems heavy to handle compared to the 180 and even though the torque is about the same it doesn't have the pickup and grunt of the V6. I've uped the boost on the turbo and put a ITG filter in but it still feels pretty flat and unrewarding to drive.

The brakes are considerably duller than the 180 so late braking into the corners is a bit unpredictable. I know it has smaller discs in the front but I didn't think it would make too much difference. Wrong.

It also has no end of rattles in the cabin. I've fixed about 3-4 but there are still at least another three which I've been unable to trace, including a bolt rolling around in the chassis somewhere which is highly annoying. I think a lot of these rattles are due to the engine vibrations, as when it starts up the whole car vibrates and shakes.

To top it all I've just completed 405 miles of town and country driving to find that it took 50 litres of fuel... so that's 36mpg! My 180 used to average around 27-29, so I'm not even getting much benefit from MPG.

I'll be going back to a 180 soon if I've can't get used the diesel and get some better performance and MPG out of it. I guess I took my 180 for granted but now I'm missing it like crazy!
 

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Commission Number 000744
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2,651 Posts
Not a lot you can do about the noise but certainly sounds like theres something wrong regarding oomph and consumption, with had 25 diesel and that was a little pocket rocket.
 

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Get it LPG converted, 20% better performance and 25% better mpg, makes the derv burn a lot cleaner.
 

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well if you are going back to a 180 i might be interested in a deal with your derv ! mines a 54 plate mk2 xpg hatch catback stainless scorpion , innner wing induction and decatted,,,just let me know
 

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407 Posts
the Derv in standard trim shold return 45mpg day in day out, with the ability to get over 60mpg under the right dirving conditions.

I just completed a trip bristol -> silverstone -> epsom -> Ticeshurst (bit further south than Tonbridge Wells) -> bristol.

gone over 400 miles and only used 3/4 the tank, so will be about 40L need to go in. Mine is heavily tuned (although poorly), so it really suggests yours is not quite right.

Out of spec MAF's cause poor economy, as do gummed up EGR valves, or splits in the boost hoses.

I would double check the above, and if not give it a good dose of injector cleaner and give it a bit of a thrashing...

Mainly though driving style is the biggest factor, if you rev it like a 180 you will kill the economy - short shift at 3-3500 rpm and never go above 4000rpm to avoid taking the real hits in economy.

If you car is a 115, then it should have an extra 20lbsft torque on top of the 180's peak.
 

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YELLOW PERIL
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2,407 Posts
Agree with the last two, my derv has had a decat, boost up a bit, BMC panel filter, remap and mafram box, Powerflow exhaust, bit like a tractor on start up, but runs smoothly and revs all the way up to the limiter, as quick as you can change gears.

Been round Brands a few times as a novice and found the car goes well, brakes are good on mine, but thats with all new disks and pads.

Dont know much about timing but have you had the belts done?? Is the timing correct, dont know how the derv pump is set up, but is this running right??

The boost pipes have a habit of splitting, or falling off, had that once with mine and it wouldnt rev or run. New pipe sorted it. Sure its only something thats a little out.

Hope you get it sorted.

:wave:
 

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The Pope
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3,408 Posts
I just got 670 miles out of a tankfull and that was all sorts of driving. However I have set mine up to maximise the mpg as well as giving it a good dose of power too. Mk2 ZS diesels are notoriously tetchy about duff MAF sensors and get a right strop on if the EGR is not working right. I can only suggest you get the EGR valve removed and cleaned, a new pierburg MAF and a MAFAM from RoverRon and then use an obdII reader to clear all stored fault codes.
Jim
 

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Lovin' the torque
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288 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Update:

Well I read a post on here about cleaning the MAF sensor, but I couldn't get the security bolt off so I just sprayed it with carb cleaner and blew it dry with an air hose and OMG!... it's like a different car! The motor pulls strong and smooth from around 1700 revs right up to 4k. It's a real pleasure to drive and now and great for towing my trailer. It now averages 45mpg as well, even when towing. Strangely the bolt in the chassis has stopped rolling around too, but there are still about 4 or 5 various rattles in the dashboard and door cards that I haven't sorted yet. If I get those fixed I'll be very happy with it. Phew, what a turnaround!
 

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Just thought I'd detail my experience when going from a 180 to TDI recently.

I'd been thinking about changing my 180 to a TDI for a long time. I absolutely loved the Mk2 180 but I'd had it for over 4 years and 64k miles so I fancied a change, and some better MPG. So I managed to find a 115 TDI ZS with only 26k miles and the full 180 kit, including body kit, spoiler, wheels and climate control. Brilliant... or so I thought!

So I bought the diesel and sold my 180 to a friend for a bargain price (in retrospect) but so far I have to say I've found the diesel disappointing. It seems heavy to handle compared to the 180 and even though the torque is about the same it doesn't have the pickup and grunt of the V6. I've uped the boost on the turbo and put a ITG filter in but it still feels pretty flat and unrewarding to drive.

The brakes are considerably duller than the 180 so late braking into the corners is a bit unpredictable. I know it has smaller discs in the front but I didn't think it would make too much difference. Wrong.

It also has no end of rattles in the cabin. I've fixed about 3-4 but there are still at least another three which I've been unable to trace, including a bolt rolling around in the chassis somewhere which is highly annoying. I think a lot of these rattles are due to the engine vibrations, as when it starts up the whole car vibrates and shakes.

To top it all I've just completed 405 miles of town and country driving to find that it took 50 litres of fuel... so that's 36mpg! My 180 used to average around 27-29, so I'm not even getting much benefit from MPG.

I'll be going back to a 180 soon if I've can't get used the diesel and get some better performance and MPG out of it. I guess I took my 180 for granted but now I'm missing it like crazy!
The engine does not help old perkins boat engine. But thats the joys of MG not being allowed to buy the fiat dcti as most other manufactures used, which would of seen 150 bhp 6 speed configuration used in all the MG range.

Thanks BMW for again tieing the hands of MGR.

Thats why the ZT had the old 3 series lump hence on 116 bhp to start when new version 150 in 3 series.........
 

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Still not cured of MG addiction
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7,110 Posts
Update:

Well I read a post on here about cleaning the MAF sensor, but I couldn't get the security bolt off so I just sprayed it with carb cleaner and blew it dry with an air hose and OMG!... it's like a different car! The motor pulls strong and smooth from around 1700 revs right up to 4k. It's a real pleasure to drive and now and great for towing my trailer. It now averages 45mpg as well, even when towing. Strangely the bolt in the chassis has stopped rolling around too, but there are still about 4 or 5 various rattles in the dashboard and door cards that I haven't sorted yet. If I get those fixed I'll be very happy with it. Phew, what a turnaround!
I didn't see your post first time round, but was just reading through thinking - MAF SENSOR!!!

I had the same problem, I bought a Rover 45 diesel for getting to work and it was rough as hell, had a huge flat spot and was horrible to drive. The noise from the engine when started from cold was unbelievable too!

I tried the test of unplugging the MAF and it transformed the car, so I got a MAFAM and tuned it to do the trick.

Amazing how the L-Series engine degrades from a single sensor.

Glad you got your car sorted, it would have been quite easy to think that's the way they are and get rid.
 

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Out Of Touch
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230 Posts
Have been thinking of chopping the 180 for a Mk2 Diesel too, as if im honest i rarely use the power of it and the mpg does hurt, but to be honest I've never given it any serious consideration. For the odd occasion where i stretch her legs, the V6 is a beauty.
 

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Still not cured of MG addiction
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7,110 Posts
Have been thinking of chopping the 180 for a Mk2 Diesel too, as if im honest i rarely use the power of it and the mpg does hurt, but to be honest I've never given it any serious consideration. For the odd occasion where i stretch her legs, the V6 is a beauty.
At least with the ZS180 you can make a difference with driving style.

I did some runs in mine, very slow on motorway and got 330+ to a tank.

The IS200 I changed to is always poor on fuel regardless of how its driven!
 

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I have both a 180 and a derv so I get the best of both
 

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Lovin' the torque
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288 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
I didn't see your post first time round, but was just reading through thinking - MAF SENSOR!!!

I had the same problem, I bought a Rover 45 diesel for getting to work and it was rough as hell, had a huge flat spot and was horrible to drive. The noise from the engine when started from cold was unbelievable too!

I tried the test of unplugging the MAF and it transformed the car, so I got a MAFAM and tuned it to do the trick.

Amazing how the L-Series engine degrades from a single sensor.

Glad you got your car sorted, it would have been quite easy to think that's the way they are and get rid.
Yeah I was just starting to think about selling it on before I cleaned the MAF. I still can't quite get over how much of a difference it made. There must be so many L series engines out there running like mine was with the people who drive them being none the wiser!
 

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Registered
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yeah it is really quite surprising how much it affects things - especially if you realise that it is completely ignored in the older cars.

Know a lot of tuners from the SDI's that just get rid of it altogether when they blank off the EGR system as that was the only thing it has anything to do with operating on them!

I have got round my MAF issue bu putting a different turbo and remapping it :lol: if i plug my mafam in, the aiflow becomes too great and the car goes into default mode.

was much easier to just leave it as it was, then try to find where to raise the flow limits in the ECU :)
 

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The Devils Fuel
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123 Posts
Just thought I'd detail my experience when going from a 180 to TDI recently.

I'd been thinking about changing my 180 to a TDI for a long time. I absolutely loved the Mk2 180 but I'd had it for over 4 years and 64k miles so I fancied a change, and some better MPG. So I managed to find a 115 TDI ZS with only 26k miles and the full 180 kit, including body kit, spoiler, wheels and climate control. Brilliant... or so I thought!

So I bought the diesel and sold my 180 to a friend for a bargain price (in retrospect) but so far I have to say I've found the diesel disappointing. It seems heavy to handle compared to the 180 and even though the torque is about the same it doesn't have the pickup and grunt of the V6. I've uped the boost on the turbo and put a ITG filter in but it still feels pretty flat and unrewarding to drive.

The brakes are considerably duller than the 180 so late braking into the corners is a bit unpredictable. I know it has smaller discs in the front but I didn't think it would make too much difference. Wrong.

It also has no end of rattles in the cabin. I've fixed about 3-4 but there are still at least another three which I've been unable to trace, including a bolt rolling around in the chassis somewhere which is highly annoying. I think a lot of these rattles are due to the engine vibrations, as when it starts up the whole car vibrates and shakes.

To top it all I've just completed 405 miles of town and country driving to find that it took 50 litres of fuel... so that's 36mpg! My 180 used to average around 27-29, so I'm not even getting much benefit from MPG.

I'll be going back to a 180 soon if I've can't get used the diesel and get some better performance and MPG out of it. I guess I took my 180 for granted but now I'm missing it like crazy!
Hi ive had four ZS's two dervs one being a facelift td which i had mapped to 140 BHP, i have just swoped my 1.6 silver facelift lpg'd ZS for a Firefrost Zs 180 of a guy on this forum, i have also had it LPG converted with no noticable loss in power averages around 22mpg on gas as opossed to 25-27 on petrol yet i'm only paying 70p a litre
****** get another 180 & have it gased..or remap the derv ********
 

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Unfortunately had to sell my ZS for something a little more economical, sold the ZS for some Honda vtec till I could afford a decent diesel, eventually purchased a S320 CDI Merc, yes a lot bigger than the ZS but wanted to try, economy wise it was night and day, midrange was equal to the ZS with a much quicker top end. I’m converted, now looking to part exchange the S class for a CLK 320 CDI, been re-mapped, 280bhp and 400ft/lb torque, really finding it hard to justify a sport petrol for road use these days.

Still miss my ZS though
 
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